Monday, May 21, 2007

"Giving Up"

Excerpt from a chat with Miss Curious, last week:

Miss C: why can't he just be in love with you already?!?!?!
Dolly: i know, right?
you know when he's goign to fall in love with me?
Miss C: I know when
Dolly: after i get totally heartbroken and decide conclusively i want nothing to do with him and
that's when
Miss C: yup
Dolly: there is no solution
Miss C: so are we in hell?
where nothing goes our way?!?! hahaha!
two ships passing in the night
Dolly: the solution is to give up
but i mean "give up"
Miss C: possible?
Dolly: fully accept the fact that we're going to be alone
Miss C: if we're supposedly here to propagate, and I've overcome the desire to have my own children (would adopt children who've been left)... then how is it I cannot rid myself of the need for a partner? Because propagation should be the only need for one... successful hunter/gatherer propagation
so there's a chance that we could "give up"

Dolly: what about companionship? sex? love?
should all of those come from different sources?
Miss C: yes, they should
companionship, sex, love
all byproducts of our primal instinct to reproduce

Dolly: but how do we splinter ourselves like that?
Miss C: that's what we must discover
there must be a way
Dolly: distracting ourselves with tons of hobbies and other social activity?

Miss C: yeah, drugs and alcohol

Dolly: becoming buddhist
Miss C: smoking weed and live music make me complete!
Dolly: that's what people keep suggesting to me
buddhism, not weed

Miss C: buddhism is actually pretty fucking great... but I'm personally too neurotic to "be at peace without knowing the answers"
I actually try to apply many buddhist philosophies to my life, but it's tough to achieve
how's it going for you?

Dolly: it's the wanting that's the sticky point for me
i can't imagine passion without desire
and i can't imagine life without passion
i don't want some kind of neutral life. i'll take the roller coaster any day

Miss C: I'm not sure what my answer is to that question anymore
I can completely see why you'd want it that way

Dolly: sometimes it doesn't feel like i have a choice
Miss C: you're absolutely right... it's more in theory ;-)


Stretch said...

LOL...this is pretty cute. Have one quibble, though:

"i can't imagine passion without desire"

I think passion and desire are totally separate--even mutually exclusive. Passion comes from a place of being present to all the possibilities of the moment, and alive enough to seize those possibilities and bring them into reality. Passion comes from a place of being complete with things just as they are, while moving intentionally toward making more possibilities real. Passion is moving forward and enjoying the ride, while recognizing that the only thing we can ever control is our own way of being.

Desire is almost the exact opposite of that. Desire comes from a place of "something is missing." It is a sense of being incomplete and powerless. Desire keeps us from being fully present until something external is realized. And when a desire is finally satisfied, usually it only leads to more desire. Passion, on the other hand, does not have to ever be satisfied. It is a way of being--unlike desire, which is a way of wanting that always leaves us feeling bankrupt.

This might sound like a purely semantic distinction, but it isn't. Desiring someone is completely different from feeling passionate about them. If you desire someone, you feel incomplete until you have them. When you do have them, the satisfaction of that desire is replaced by a new desire--the desire to keep them around. Your desire keeps you from being passionate about the moment in which you happen to be (which, ironically enough, makes it even more unlikely that the desire will ever be satisfied). But if you instead feel passionate about them and about helping that person realize their own possibilities, there is nothing to want--you just are that way toward them regardless of how they seem to feel about you in return. Passion is alive and powerful; desire is weak and needy.

Vicious said...


Vicious said...

I'm taking up boxing!

MissCurious said...

Passion and desire control me way too much... when I have feelings for someone, I want to explode with passion and want... it almost hurts... so, my decision is made, I'd rather be the type of person who is more consistent... not the type I actually am with the extreme highs and lows... the lows are just too low and overpower the greatness of which "our kind" is capable of feeling.

Of course, in this fantasy of being stable, I will have never known the passion I am now able to experience. All I want to understand is complacency.

I remember when I was young I always thought my parents' relationship was boring without that intense "can't live without you" passion... but now, I wish I had what they have.

And oh, last night I was thinking what if I found some great amazing love and how high that would make me feel... but that thought was immediatly followed by the knowledge of what intensity the pain would be if it ended... because in reality, most things end. Such a cynic, I am. Oops!

Hmmm. But what can I say... I am how I am... things I cannot change.

I just do the best I can.

Stretch said...

Celibacy....It's the only answer! ;-)

But I do think "Giving Up" is totally the way to go. By "giving up," we create the possibility of being pleasantly surprised:

"Nature does not possess desire;
Without desire, the heart becomes quiet;
In this manner the whole world is made tranquil."

--Ch.37 of the Tao Te Ching

Dan said...

I am about to give up too, it's the easy way out.

Descartes said...

And thereupon in your anecdotal vituperating you have hit upon the solution to your woes.

PRETEND you have moved on, when you have not. As hard as it may be.

Read art of seduction.

CoatMan said...

I empathise with the romantic hell thing...

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